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The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported a rising number of cases of mysterious pneumonias linked to vaping on Friday. Now, the agency reports 450 people from 33 states and one U.S. jurisdiction have been affected.

Three deaths have been confirmed, authorities said, and another is being investigated.

The New England Journal of Medicine and CDC’s online journal, Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report coordinated the release of case reports and case findings from Illinois and Wisconsin, Utah, North Carolina and California. While the descriptions of the cases were remarkably similar, it is not currently clear why young vapers — the majority of cases are young men — are developing severe pneumonias.

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Many of the people who developed the respiratory illness — which in some cases requires days of mechanical ventilation — admitted to vaping tetrahydrocannabinol or THC, the main active ingredient in cannabis. Others said they vaped THC and nicotine while some said they only used nicotine products with their e-cigarettes.

Mitch Zeller, director of the Food and Drug Administration’s center for tobacco products, said FDA labs have been testing samples of vaping products collected by state health departments in their investigations of cases.

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The FDA currently has 120 samples it is testing, looking for pesticides, toxins, poisons, cutting agents and additives as well as other chemicals, Zeller said. But so far there is no evident answer.

“The samples we’re evaluating show a mix of results and no one substance or compound, including vitamin E acetate, has been identified in all of the samples tested, Zeller said.

The illness has been described as a lipoid pneumonia, with lipids — fats — in the lungs. But Dr. Dana Meaney-Delman, CDC’s incident manager for the outbreak, warned that it’s too soon to know if the lipids are a reliable clue.

She also noted that it is currently unclear whether these illnesses represent something new, or a health risk that has been newly recognized.

Reports of similar pneumonias among e-cigarette users have not come from other countries at this point. A CDC spokeswoman said that the agency has reached out to partner organizations, including the Public Health Agency of Canada, to ask if they are seeing similar cases. “At this time we’re not aware of any cases outside of the United States. However we are sharing information with international partners in the event that cases have gone unrecognized,” she said.

While investigations are underway, both the CDC and the FDA urged people to stop vaping. People who intend to continue to vape should buy their products from reliable stores, they said, and refrain from mixing products.

  • I’ve been vaping nicotine since 2011. AND IM STILL ALIVE. My doctor has never found any lung damage, and I’ve never been sickened by a nicotine vape. I’ve had some “vape juices” that irritated my lungs, but I just stopped vaping it and found a better product. And because it’s legal there’s been FDA regulation to prevent harmful ingredients in vape juices.
    I’ve read a lot of negative press about vaping, and I’ve always said the same thing. MILLIONS of people die from smoking cigarettes EVERY SINGLE YEAR. If vaping killed a tiny fraction of the amount of people cigarettes kill, they would be illegal.
    I’m also a marijuana user, and I will say that I’ve used thc “vapes” and thought many of them were fake or diluted. Quite a few of them irritated my lungs. Me being an adult and more cautious of things that harm me made me stop. Kids don’t always have a well developed sense of self preservation. The problem is the vape liquids are much more accessible now that some states have legal or medical marijuana and some states don’t, and there isn’t enough regulation. What drug dealers aren’t going to cut their product to make a more profitable product? Drug dealer 101.
    Let’s look back to prohibition of alcohol. Everything you need to make alcohol can be easily grown or purchased. So people all over America were making “bathtub gin” and other amateur booze and thousands were sickened or even killed. Probably the #2 reason prohibition was repealed, with the #1 reason of course being crime.
    WHAT WE NEED IS MORE REGULATION. Dealers are making “bathtub vapes”. It’s making people sick and killing people and they don’t know what they’re doing. Or they don’t care.
    Electronic cigs have been on the market for almost two decades, but the difference is, nicotine isn’t illegal, and so there have always been bonafide companies selling “vape liquid”. Many vape liquid companies submit their formulas to the FDA, and the FDA is capable of regulating their product, so no company is going to put ingredient in the vape juice not caring if it makes someone sick or not. But you’ve got a product (marijuana) legal in some states but illegal in others and so now we’ve increased public availability exponentially, but there is no federal regulation. There are literally states illegalizing flavored vapes. Well jokes on them, because they didn’t ban unflavored vaping products. So guess what? You can buy everything you need to make unflavored vaping liquid online. You can also buy unflavored vaping liquid online, at any nicotine concentration. All vaping flavorings are just food grade flavorings, and those individually aren’t illegal so you’re just going to have a bunch of people making it themselves and of course some are going to distribute it for profit. And somehow there will be mistakes made and people will get sick. Because prohibition doesn’t work, but regulation does.

  • I’ve been vaping nicotine for over 8 years. I’m still alive. I have no health problems.
    I started using vapes this year. I had chronic bronchitis and they made me cough. Then I looked at most of the packaging. Not even a company name listed, “85% thc” as a description. Wtf? I ascertained pretty early on this crap is fake and these dealers are cutting this for profit like they cut everything else. Bc if they didn’t, they wouldn’t be very good drug dealers would they.
    Governments throughout history have had to step in and regulate products that they knew the public was never going to stop using and therefore producing. Like beer in Germany in the 1500’s. Another reason for ending prohibition was because people were making their own booze and people were getting sick or dying from it. This is the same thing. Marijuana products are never going to go away. With some states legalizing, and some states not, it has only increased supply, variety of supply and demand is probably almost infinite. Marijuana needs to be legalized and regulated at a federal level. Just like alcohol.

  • —– The below info isn’t written by me, but I thought I should share —–
    I’m sure that most of you have seen the stories on the local and national media regarding “lung disease” caused by vaping. Hopefully you also saw the previous email from us relating to this story. What’s important for you to know is that 80% of these cases have been tied directly to illegal THC cartridges. I have no reason to believe the other 20% won’t be linked to the same cause, it’s just that people are hesitant to be honest because of the fear of legal trouble.

    I find it very disheartening and disingenuous that the CDC has chosen to be extremely vague in suggesting that electronic cigarettes have any role in the “outbreak”. Personally, I believe that the CDC is putting lives in danger by not passing along the real evidence and being clear about the findings. At this juncture, their lack of honesty is negligent, in my opinion.

    I assure you that our products are of the highest quality and are in no way related to these events. We personally consume everything that we offer to our customers. We have many family members and personal friends who shop with us, and we consider all of our customers as family. We have always looked out for the best interests of our customers and that will never change. We stand behind the quality of our products, 100%.

    As always, we’ll be closely monitoring this situation and will pass along any important information if it affects us. Here is a link to some good reading from Dr. Michael Siegel: https://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2019/09/cdcs-obfuscation-of-link-between.html

  • Lawrence —

    The reason for the surge is due to the easy access of fake (non regulated) THC cartridges that anyone can get. It’s so easy for kids to get these online. The people that make them usually live in a legal state and purchase marijuana, empty carts and packaging, they make the THC liquid in their kitchens, fill the tanks, pack them and sell them. There are tons of people on instagram (it usually says “nothing for sale” – but that’s exactly what they are doing) they have pretty pictures of marijuana, carts, people smoking, edibles etc.. There’s no telling what people mix the liquids with. They aren’t professionals, but they are profiting like crazy. They post their contact info (several apps for contacting them) on several websites. For example, leafly.com is site that discuss strains and there is a place to leave comments. Go there right now to check out a strain and I bet the most recent comment is someone saying how to contact them and selling carts for cheap. They are sold on ebay, facebook, any app that you can exchange money. Anyway… That’s why the kids are getting sick. They are buying fake carts with THC liquid (w/ who knows what else inside them). Teens will be teens. I know I thought nothing would hurt me when I was young and dumb. Also, some of it could be fake all around, meaning no THC – just garbage in a cart; they are doing it to make money. The kids and adults are buying it because it’s cheap and/or because they aren’t in a legal state.

    And as the quote goes, ‘Never let any crisis/tragedy go to waste’. They are using this for their own means.

    ————————————————————————————-
    Lawrence
    September 10, 2019 at 1:47 pm:
    “”Shannon, how do you explain that this new illness has only recently cropped up and in a predominantly male population, despite the popularity of vaporizing THC going back well over a decade, and being used by all demographics? Do you have any thoughts as to why the recent surge in popularity of “traditional e-cigs” such as Jule seems track almost perfectly with the bout of illness?

    E-cigs may be a substitute for smoking, but are far from the most effective way to “quit”. We’re seeing an alarming increase in nicotine dependence, particularly in youth. How many of these youths will graduate to cigarettes? I’d hope any scheme plotted by the government would not be so obviously flawed.

    I’d urge anyone to “do their own research” also, but if their “research” is merely dredging up conspiracy theories from completely nonfactual sources in order to corroborate their preconceptions, then there may be some merit to allowing researchers to do the research.””

    • Sterling, I find it very plausible that ‘fake’ THC cartridges could be one factor causing illness. It seems likely that whatever is behind these illnesses lies in the liquid that is heated and inhaled to produce copious volumes of vapor, or perhaps contaminants in the liquid or devices. Nicotine or THC. Even aside from the liquid, I certainly don’t savor the idea of repeatedly putting a steel or plastic tube in my mouth and breathing through it daily, considering how non-sterile that would be after only a few weeks.

      What I cannot agree on that this problem is exclusive to THC vaporizers. It is highly likely the same problems exist in liquid formulations for nicotine, particularly cheaper imported ones analogous to what you described. These cheap and nasty nicotine ‘juice’ products are also widely available and out in the open. Frankly I’m concerned by knee-jerk reactions that it “must be the pot” causing this, rather than a rational consideration of the facts, and what has transpired recently in the world of vaping.

    • “What I cannot agree on that this problem is exclusive to THC vaporizers. It is highly likely the same problems exist in liquid formulations for nicotine”

      Two things here.

      1. Nicotine vaping, including extremely cheap liquids, has been around for over a decade. Not a single case of this magnitude has ever been documented. Not one. Ever. The most well-known “issue” with nicotine vape juice was the “Popcorn Lung” scare. This was an issue with the chemical Diacetyl, which was found to be in some very specific flavorings. When this was brought to light, Diacetyl was completely removed from all vape liquids nearly immediately, and even though this was done several years ago, many of the major vape liquid manufacturers today still offer GCMS reports to prove that their liquids are Diacetyl free.

      2. The is no NEED for the “cut” (Vitamin E acetate) to be added to nicotine liquid. The only purpose for it’s use in THC liquid is to increase profit for the dealers. The ingredients used to mix nicotine juice are already dirt cheap. The biggest difference between cheap liquids and expensive liquids are the amounts and brands of the flavorings, which are the most expensive ingredient in the mix.

      So, no, the problem is not, and will not be found in nicotine liquids.

  • Kit – I’m so sorry to hear about your son. I’ll be praying for him and hope he gets better. I did want to add that the issue isn’t vaping in general, it’s what you said in your post, the black market THC fake vapes that are the problem. They are so easy for kids to get, because there are hundreds (if not thousands) of people online, especially instagram, that sell these to anyone. There’s no telling what is in them and the people selling them are making them themselves in their kitchen. With that being said, all over the mainstream media they are talking about ejuice and it being marketed to kids etc. They aren’t talking about the REAL problem, which is the fake/black market non regulated thc cartridges – that’s what’s making the kids sick. I bet most kids that do get sick don’t want to tell what they were really vaping on either. I’m glad you know what it was that your kid was vaping on. I just wish they would speak more about the facts on the news.

    • Seems like marijuana needs legalized federally in order to regulate and test these oils that are being inhaled. Am I right?

    • Bob,

      I do agree with your statement. It’s going to happen regardless. It’s better to have a safe place to purchase marijuana, than to buy it from strangers online. That’s what the government should be talking about.

      That’s just my opinion, I know we all have them and we don’t all have to agree. I just think it’s safer in the long run.

  • What about paraquat? Have they looked that? Don’t forget the government sprayed plants with that agent. Maybe an old batch of pot got into the supply chain, since the bulk of these cases are THC related?

  • My son was hospitalized Friday. Double pneumonia. He’d been buying black market thc vapes. Now he’s extremely ill. Stay away from vaping ! He is getting cat scans today and on oxygen.

  • My son was hospitalized Friday. Double pneumonia. He’d been buying black market thc vapes. Now he’s extremely ill. Stay away from vaping !

  • Well said Shannon. I did a lot of real research today and everything I learned confirms your well thought out thesis here. Said it better than I ever could. Most real scientific studies have concluded that vaping is indeed at least 95% safer than smoking. THC seems to be one of the culprits in this latest scare. Ther could be other culprits as well but we’ll have to wait for thos conclusions. Another reason these stories are so hyperbolic(and I do not in any way deem to lessen the tragedy of what has occurred here in this latest episode) is the fact the Government has “skin in the game”. The CHIPS program is fully funded by tobacco taxes and the Government is losing billions due to so many millions of people deciding to do what the Government claims it wants us to do…quit smoking cigarettes by turning to the much safer alternative of Vaping. The latest Scientific study I read reflected the amount of toxins in the blood stream as a result of vaping was almost zero, over 100 times less than smoking tobacco and as safe or even safer than most alternative methods of smoking cessation.

    Steve

    • Lawrence, see some of my sources below. The research I did that day was related to the latest story concerning these mysterious vaping illnesses. However, I have been researching Vaping as it concerns health issues off and on for a few years. Hope this answers your snarky question.

      Expert Review of Respiratory Medicine

      Public Health England and the Royal College of Physicians

      UK Center for Tobacco and Alcohol Studies at Queen Mary University of London

      US National Institutes of Health

      The Journal Addiction

      Preventive Medicine at Queen Mary University of London

      Thanks Lawrence,
      Steve

  • Federal officials DO know what the cause is, but they don’t want to make it public. These illnesses and deaths are being caused by vaping THC (pot), they are NOT being caused by vaping traditional e-cigs or other vape products.

    Not to sound like a tin-foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist, but the government absolutely does NOT want people to stop smoking, and vaping is by far the easiest and most effective way to quit. States rely on the money they get from the 1998 Master Settlement Agreement (the “Tobacco Settlement”). Most states have sold bonds against the settlement money they expect to get for years to come. If people quit smoking, they risk defaulting on these bonds.

    I would urge everyone to do your own research on this, and on vaping in general. I cannot say that vaping is 100% safe (no one can without enough proper, unbiased research) … but I can say that vaping is 10000x safer than smoking. It has saved tens of thousands of lives, and could save millions if the government would get behind it.

    • no, it‘s not 10000x safer. Maybe safer, but not that much. Smoking and vaping both put aerosols deep into your lungs, and this has a whole laundry list of consequences. Removing nicotine and tar reduces the list, but some risks remain. Not much research on this, mainly because vaping products and devices are barely regulated or monitored.

    • Jens,

      Vape liquid consists of 3 ingredients (assuming it is bought from, or made by a reliable source) … Propolyne Glycol, wich has been used in vapor form in medical devices (such as Albuterol inhalers) since the 1940’s. PG is also one of the best known anti-bacterial and anti-microbial substances to purify air. It is commonly used by hospitals in the NICU to prevent some of the most fragile humans on Earth from being exposed to airborne illnesses.

      Vegetable Glycerine, or VG, has a GRAS rating by the FDA (Generally Recognized As Safe). While there are no specific studies to “prove” it is safe, there have also been no specific studies to “prove” is is not safe.

      Not that put “prove’ in quotes there. There have been many studies, most of them fairly recent that claim to “prove” many things. But these studies have been EXTREMELY biased. (See my comment above for why). In many of these studies, the “scientists” that have done them have been PROVEN to have manipulated the outcomes to fit their agenda. The most common ways this has been done is by testing vape products outside of their normal usage parameters. In simple terms … they crank up the voltage and wattage to well beyond what is normal, if not even possible under normal use, and at those extreme conditions, they have produced toxins. They have also used lower grades of products than what is used to make vape liquids. Vape liquid uses 99.9% pure, USP grade VG. The biased testers often will use less pure ingredients to “prove’ toxicity.

      And the last ingredient is the flavorings. This is the “big unknown”, but it is not as unknown as most would believe it to be. Vaping has been around for well over a decade now, and the industry has done extensive testing on its own. At this point, most, if not all of the harmful flavorings have been eliminated. The so called “popcorn lung” scare tactic, was caused by the use of flavorings that contained Diacetyl. Diacetyl has been entirely removed from all commercially made vape liquids for years now, and many brands include GCMS testing results to show that their liquids are Diacetyl free.

      (Very) long story short here … nothing is 100% safe. The air we breath is not “safe”. But compared to smoking, yes, I believe vaping is “10000x” safer. I could argue that it is 480,000x safer … because that is the number of deaths that are contributed to smoking each year … and to date, there is not a single case of a death caused by vaping commercially available, nicotine products. EVERY SINGLE ONE of these recent cases are caused by either THC vaping, or “black market” pods.

    • Shannon, how do you explain that this new illness has only recently cropped up and in a predominantly male population, despite the popularity of vaporizing THC going back well over a decade, and being used by all demographics? Do you have any thoughts as to why the recent surge in popularity of “traditional e-cigs” such as Jule seems track almost perfectly with the bout of illness?

      E-cigs may be a substitute for smoking, but are far from the most effective way to “quit”. We’re seeing an alarming increase in nicotine dependence, particularly in youth. How many of these youths will graduate to cigarettes? I’d hope any scheme plotted by the government would not be so obviously flawed.

      I’d urge anyone to “do their own research” also, but if their “research” is merely dredging up conspiracy theories from completely nonfactual sources in order to corroborate their preconceptions, then there may be some merit to allowing researchers to do the research.

    • Lawrence,

      Obviously, this isn’t the greatest forum to be able to cite references and provide backup to statements, so about the best I can do, is to both simply ask you to “trust me’ … but to also do your own research on this, as well as apply some basic common sense.

      Vaporizing THC does not “go back for well over a decade”, especially in it’s current form. Until very recently, THC “pens” were only a heating element being used to smoke cannabis in plant form. One of the earliest of these pens was marketed by Snoop Dogg, the “G Pen”, and it did not appear until late 2013.

      The current method of vaping THC in a liquid form was a product of legalization, and it did not become “popular” until very recently. (Last 3 years, give or take). My “explanation” of the current illness outbreak lies with the increased popularity of THC vaping, the more widespread legalization of THC products, and (most importantly) the use of Vitamin E Acetate as a “cutting agent” in homemade and counterfeit THC cartomizers and pods.

      In the vast majority of the illnesses and death cases reported recently, the person or their family has stated that they were vaping THC, many even knowing that their products were black market. In the remainder of those cases, I believe they are just not admitting to what they were actually using. Teenagers are not know to be the most truthful bunch, especially when it comes to drug use. And people in general are not going to admit to using THC concentrates, since in many areas, they are still illegal, even a felony.

      “E-cigs may be a substitute for smoking, but are far from the most effective way to “quit”. We’re seeing an alarming increase in nicotine dependence, particularly in youth. How many of these youths will graduate to cigarettes? I’d hope any scheme plotted by the government would not be so obviously flawed.”

      This is a bit of a multi-part question/statement.

      As for the effectiveness of quitting. As I mentioned, I am a member of CASAA, a pro-vaping organization, and through that organization, I have heard literally hundreds of thousands of former smokers that have quit smoking using vaping. We ALL had tried many, many times to quit before without success. Vaping satisfies both the craving for nicotine, as well as the habitual part of the addiction. No other method does this. It either supplies the quitter with nicotine (patches / gum) but does nothing for the habit, or it suppresses the habit (medication). Have you seen some of the side effects of that medication. One of them is SUICIDE. And worst yet, suicide as a side effect is more prevalent the younger you are.

      As for the next part of your comment, nicotine dependence, and youths progressing to smoking. First of all, I do not suggest anyone start vaping if they do not smoke. IF someone does … vaping is not exclusive to nicotine. If you just have to vape to “fit in” or “be cool” … vape 0 nicotine. But, my main rebuttal to this argument is that the same teen that starts vaping for these reasons, is going to be the same teen that starts smoking for the very same reasons.

      As for progressing to cigarettes … why the hell would they (unless of course the Government takes away the safer alternative, AFTER they have already started). Smoking a cigarette after vaping is like licking an ashtray. It is honestly worse than smoking for the first time. Way worse.

      An finally, the “scheme plotted by the Government”. I am not one for conspiracy theories, trust me. But when it comes to the Government and money, I believe it surpasses a “theory”. If the Government didn’t care about money and the Big Tobacco lobby, and actually cared about the health of it’s citizens .. then why the HELL is smoking still legal at all? Why are we even discussing what is undeniably, at the very least, a safer alternative to smoking, and not discussing the most deadly, legal product sold? As I also mentioned in my original comment … the money from the Master Settlement Agreement (the “Tobacco Settlement”) has already been spent for years to come via selling bonds against it. The amount of money each state receives is directly related to the sales of tobacco. Less smokers, less money. Less money … bond forfeiture (or they have to cover them from other revenue). If it were not for this Master Settlement money, I have little to no doubt that we would already have seen legitimate testing from the FDA on nicotine vaping, and would likely have already seen cigarettes banned. You can call this a conspiracy theory if you like … but please tell me one common sense reason, other than money, why we still allow a product as deadly as cigarettes to be sold legally in this country?

    • Shannon, the technique of vaporizing THC dates back to the early 1990s with the invention of a vaporizer by Bill Amato, and a few years later the invention of the Volcano which was on the market in 2000 and tremendously popular. “Well over a decade” was a conservative estimate, as arguably it has been over two decades. Countless portable and non-portable devices have been developed and widely used without widespread illness since the early 2000s. Vaporizing cannabis is simply not new, despite what Snoop Dogg might have attempted to commercialize well after the fact.

      If you mean to say that the actual cause of the illness is from a particular device or contaminant found certain liquid THC formulations, perhaps you should clarify, instead of scapegoating THC vaporizing. Clearly, this new health issue lies in the vehicle or devices to vaporize, which are used in e-cigarettes and THC vaporizers alike.

      I heard a recent report that as many as 25% of high schoolers now vape. While I don’t have a source, it was mentioned on NPR who have their own fact checkers. I am doubtful that these same students would have adopted cigarette smoking had there never been vape pens. Smoking certainly wasn’t that prevalent when I went to school, and I was regrettably a smoker at that time, so was well aware of who I could bum a smoke from. The attraction to vaping is very apparent in youth, and regardless of what you would recommend, it is happening and gaining popularity. It is also telling that the government are now looking to ban flavors that are most popular with kids, e.g., bubblegum. One reason to progress to smoking cigarettes may be the discovery that they’re a way to get nicotine without developing pneumonia?

      I don’t think it is fair to state that the only reason we are seeing health issues linked to e-cigarette use is propaganda by the government to make sure cigarettes are not replaced by e-cigarettes. That is a far-fetched idea, and if the government did have such ulterior motives I could think of faster ways to achieve it. Not to mention, e-cigarettes are derived from the same tobacco plants, so they are not mutually exclusive revenue streams. More likely, there’s a legitimate health risk to e-cigarettes that you choosing to deny, because you are involved in a pro-vaping organization, and probably don’t like the idea that you could get sick. Go cold turkey.

    • Lawrence,

      You seem to be reasonably well educated, or at least educated enough to use Google. But you also seem to be unreasonably close minded. You are either unintentionally overlooking many of the points I have made, or intentionally overlooking them to further your position.

      This discussion is specifically regarding vaporizing liquids … THC or Nicotine. The Volcano Vaporizer is just a larger version of the G-Pen. It is vaporizing cannabis flower, or concentrate. (I.E “pot” or “hash / wax”). For purposes of THIS discussion, you are comparing Apples to Oranges here.

      “If you mean to say that the actual cause of the illness is from a particular device or contaminant found certain liquid THC formulations, perhaps you should clarify, instead of scapegoating THC vaporizing”

      As I have stated multiple times … do your own research. There are literally thousands of articles written in the last week on this subject. But, if it makes you feel better … Yes, this issue is being caused by Vitamin E acetate being used as a “cut”, or filler by people making and selling counterfeit or “black market” THC liquid vape pods. This issue has nothing to do with smoking cannabis, or vaporizing cannabis. It doesn’t even have anything to do with vaping THC liquids that were produced correctly by legitimate sources. The people that are producing these black market pods are no different than any other drug dealer that cuts their product to increase their profits.

      “I heard a recent report that as many as 25% of high schoolers now vape”

      You are actually probably a little low on that estimate, at least from what I have seen. But I don’t know when you went to school, but when I did (late 80’s), at LEAST 25% of the people smoked. And while I don’t advocate for any teen to vape … it is a HELL of a lot better than smoking. IF they are going to pick up one habit or the other (and statistically speaking, they will), why in the hell would we want them to pick up the one that we know, without any doubt at all, is likely to eventually kill them?

      “It is also telling that the government are now looking to ban flavors that are most popular with kids, e.g., bubblegum”

      You know who else those flavors are popular with? Adults. Why? Because cigarettes taste like ass. One of the many things that makes vaping such a successful method of quitting smoking is the flavors. After sucking on something that tastes like crap for 20 years, I quite enjoy vaping my Mango – Pineapple blend juice. And it is not just the Government looking to ban “flavors like bubblegum” … it is banning ALL flavors. Everything but tobacco.

      “One reason to progress to smoking cigarettes may be the discovery that they’re a way to get nicotine without developing pneumonia?”

      Did I mention that not one person, EVER, has developed pneumonia, or any other similar illness from vaping nicotine? None. This is just an example of you either being “thick”, or uninformed. You produce me ONE fully verified, non-biased example of a person developing a serious illness, such as pneumonia, from vaping legitimately produced nicotine liquid, and I will write a $1000 check to your favorite charity.

      “I don’t think it is fair to state that the only reason we are seeing health issues linked to e-cigarette use is propaganda by the government to make sure cigarettes are not replaced by e-cigarettes”

      I am going to assume that you, like many other people, are fairly new to all the controversy surrounding vaping. Those of us that have been vaping for the last 10 years, and especially those of us that have been active in vape advocacy have been dealing with the Government trying to regulate, control, tax, or ban vaping for years. This isn’t new to us. They have been trying for a long time. What makes this different, is now they have bodies to hang their agenda on. Until now, the only argument they could make was “We haven’t had enough time to test it” and “We don’t know what the long term effects may be”. They are using these illnesses and deaths caused by a completely different product to push a years old agenda.

      So, if you do not believe that the money from the Master Settlement Agreement is the root cause for this … what is? Health Concerns? If they were concerned with health, why not ban tobacco. It is a KNOWN killer. If you did some research, you would find exactly what I have said to be true. There is not ONE case of a person getting seriously ill from vaping nicotine. All you will find are people that have had allergic reactions, and occasionally, you can find cases of nicotine overdose … most likely caused by either drinking the liquid, or improperly made “home-brew” juice where they put WAY to much nicotine in the mix.

      “Not to mention, e-cigarettes are derived from the same tobacco plants, so they are not mutually exclusive revenue stream”

      The vast majority of nicotine used in current vape juice is not extracted from tobacco. Obviously companies like Juul that are owned by Big Tobacco companies use it, but most commercially made e-liquid does not.

      Lawrence, I have to be honest. I am not sure exactly what dog you have in this fight. If you think I am “bashing” the use of cannabis or THC, I’m not. While I don’t partake in that particular vice (or at least haven’t in about 25 years), I am 100% a supporter of legalized adult use. I am also NOT an advocate for youths vaping. But what we need here are stricter regulations on purchasing vape products, MUCH stiffer penalties on minors in possession of vape AND tobacco products, and MUCH stiffer penalties on anyone who purchases and supplies them with it. There is ZERO reason to take a product away that has helped millions of adult smokers quit.

      “Go cold turkey.”

      If it were that easy, do you think nearly a half million people a year would be dying from smoking?

    • Shannon, hello again. I am not overlooking your comments at all. I’m being quite direct in responding to you, and I quote:
      “These illnesses and deaths are being caused by vaping THC (pot), they are NOT being caused by vaping traditional e-cigs or other vape products.”
      As I mentioned, perhaps you should clarify that you meant to refer to a liquid that is commonly used with black market THC formulations. Before, when you were implying that deaths are “caused by vaping THC (pot),” you were stating something that clearly neither of us agree with, and I am glad you have corrected yourself.
      I don’t have a dog in this fight, which is perhaps why I can be less biased about the so-called benefits of e-cigarettes, and recognize that they’re causing more youth than ever before to pick up a nicotine addiction. You’ve made it clear that you’re a stalwart defender of one side, and willing to put your head in the sand far more than I have.
      I’m more than happy to do my own research, but please be honest with yourself that collating news articles is a far-cry from research, and certainly doesn’t warrant the self-righteous tone you’re taking on with me. I quit cold turkey so I don’t need convincing of how hard it is. People who cannot stop are not willing to quit, and developing an addiction to e-cigarettes is not quitting. I honestly don’t have time right now to field the remainder of your questions/tangents, it is not merely because I am thick.

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